Content Monetization and the Future of Marketing with Joe Pulizzi

Joe Pulizzi [00:00:00]:
You have to think of your organization like you are, a professional basketball team or baseball team or something like that, where you are gonna A, your marketing is gonna be behind your stars. Well, your stars are your employees. They’re your product managers. They’re your engineers. They’re your communications people. Let them out. Your employees are your best marketers and you’re hiding them.

Announcer [00:00:23]:
Influential and thought provoking minds in marketing, sales, and business, A business of marketing podcast.

A. Lee Judge [00:00:32]:
Welcome again to the business of marketing. I’m A Lee Judge. And with me today is the godfather of content marketing, Joe Pulizzi. Hey, Joe.

Joe Pulizzi [00:00:42]:
Lee, how are you, my friend?

A. Lee Judge [00:00:43]:
How you like that intro? You tired of that title yet?

Joe Pulizzi [00:00:46]:
You know what? I have totally leaned into it. I used to be I don’t know. Ten years ago, I was like, oh, come on. That’s just overdone. And then I’m like, you know, if people remember it, I I just lean into anything that people remember. That’s why, you know, I’ll wear the orange. I’ll do the thing. It works.

A. Lee Judge [00:01:01]:
I I can’t great to have the title, Joe.

Joe Pulizzi [00:01:03]:
You have the A. Complain. Even I mean, it’s it could be negative depending on how you look at it, but I’ll take it.

A. Lee Judge [00:01:10]:
Hey. It’s take it. Take it. It’s it’s it’s well deserved. So I wanna jump straight into something, Joe. CEX twenty twenty five is coming up. It’s the Content Entrepreneur Expo in A in Cleveland. It’s the event for content creators to learn strategies for audience growth and revenue generation.

A. Lee Judge [00:01:27]:
One of the most common conversations that I hear at the event is how to monetize your content. So are there any new content monetization strategies that you see gaining traction?

Joe Pulizzi [00:01:38]:
I think the most important thing, Lee, is that content creators or content entrepreneurs aren’t leveraging enough ways to monetize. I mean, we always talk about and, you know, it’s like, hey. When you’re starting out, you wanna leverage one, maybe two different platforms. You don’t you don’t wanna be jack of all trades, master of none. You really wanna focus on building an audience on one or two. And then what do we wanna do is diversify from a revenue standpoint as much as possible, and I just don’t see creators doing that. They’ll say, okay. Well, we’ll lean into sponsorship, or we’ll lean into brand deals, or maybe we’re just doing, membership or paid subs.

Joe Pulizzi [00:02:14]:
Yeah. We we need to be doing all the things, especially as smaller creators. So a lot of what we’ll talk about A Lee is look. These most of the the audience that goes there, they’re not gonna have a hundred million followers on YouTube. They’re not gonna be Jimmy Donaldson, mister Beast. They’re going to have 3,000 email subscribers or 5,000, subs on YouTube or they’re just getting started on Spotify or Substack or whatever. And what we wanna do is say, okay. Well, let’s let’s take that value and leverage it in multiple ways because we don’t know what our best revenue drivers are gonna be.

Joe Pulizzi [00:02:48]:
I remember when I started Content Marketing Institute, we didn’t know that the big thing was gonna be an event, Content Marketing World, until we started to put out different ways to drive revenue. So I think that’s the focus right now.

A. Lee Judge [00:02:59]:
Well, you’ve been been in it for a A. So I wanna ask you about this because for me, I’m just now realizing that I don’t have to do all the things at once. Like, I just released a book. Thanks for your help on

Joe Pulizzi [00:03:12]:
the book Cash.

A. Lee Judge [00:03:13]:
Thank you. And I realized that, okay, I took almost a year and a half of focus on the book. Didn’t do too many YouTube videos. I put the A and Marketing podcast on pause. I just did the book. Now A book is out. It’s an asset that is, is done. I can talk about it on podcasts and on videos.

A. Lee Judge [00:03:32]:
Now A and marketing is back. I’m doing more YouTube videos A I can mention the book because it already is done. So my lesson was, you know what? I don’t have to do all the things at once. I could not have sustained writing a book, doing a podcast, doing YouTube, you know. So what do you have to say to to content entrepreneurs who may be overwhelmed with doing everything?

Joe Pulizzi [00:03:55]:
Well, if you do everything, you’re gonna do absolutely nothing, and you just have to realize it. We want to, as content creators, do all the things. We feel we need to be everywhere, but if we do, we make a huge mistake. I mean, I always remember the stories when, Bill Gates and Warren Buffett met for the first time, and the interviewer said, put down the the key to your success. Write it down on a piece of paper and put it down on the table, and they did. And then when they turned that piece of paper over, the word was focus, both of them. I love that story because it is so true. So you have to have focus.

Joe Pulizzi [00:04:30]:
You created a great book because you focused on that book. In order to create something amazing, you’re gonna have to do that. But let’s just simplify the process. So if you are this goes for, for brand as well. But if you’re a content creator, you really A have three legs of the stool. You wanna have one place where people find you, where you’re building that audience. You then want to have some kind of physical audio digital book. That’s what you stand for.

Joe Pulizzi [00:04:56]:
That’s what you just created. That is your mission. And then you wanna have some kind of a speaking strategy so that you can spread that around to all the events and take your mission and your audience and basically put it on steroids. And I don’t think that’s too much to ask. So I think A wherever you’re at, say, okay. What’s your thing? Is it is it your website? Is it your.com? Is it your podcast? Is it your newsletter? You have to have some kind of base. That’s where you built the whole thing. And you take that, you grow it through your book, and then you take that book A you shop it all around through speaking engagements.

Joe Pulizzi [00:05:30]:
And if you do that for about twelve to eighteen months, you will really have something special. So you’re not doing all the things. You’re really just saying, oh, this is this is kind of the way you start out as a content entrepreneur.

A. Lee Judge [00:05:42]:
Well, you mentioned that thing. And since I’ve known you and since I’ve been speaking at since content marketing world, I’ve met lots of people who were content creators, speakers, experts in their fields. And I’ve noticed there’s some of them some of the most shiny ones, I’ll say. The ones with the biggest personalities and they were deepest on their thing. They either had to pivot or their thing died or, you know, what have you seen? Because you’ve seen lots of speakers evolve, lots of content creators evolve. You’ve probably seen some pivots or some people who had to bury whatever their thing was. What have you seen and how does somebody pivot if they need to?

Joe Pulizzi [00:06:23]:
Well, first of all, I don’t know of a marketer or a content creator that hasn’t pivoted in some way. We all pivot because you start out with this big, shiny A, and then you don’t have any information on whether it’s good or bad, and you take it out in the A. And then you get feedback. And then based on that feedback, you adjust just like you would with any product. So we’re that’s best Lee, the reason why I love events. Because when you go out and you talk to people, you will get firsthand feedback of what you’re doing right and what you’re doing wrong. Or, like, I didn’t know it was content marketing. I didn’t know that was the thing, but I started going around A speaking in front of A.

Joe Pulizzi [00:07:04]:
And I heard other people talk, and I talked to other experts. And I realized, I think that’s the thing. I think I didn’t I thought maybe it was custom publishing, maybe it was custom media, maybe it was custom content. I didn’t know what the term was, but then I talked to enough people and got that feedback and went that direction. So I pivoted many A, and you will, and we all do to find that portion. So I guess the point is is that you make the Judge. You do the thing. You start creating the content.

Joe Pulizzi [00:07:30]:
You know full well. All you wanna look for is, okay. I know I’m failing right now. Get that feedback as soon as I can so I can make that pivot and then build that mission that really works with your audience.

A. Lee Judge [00:07:41]:
Marketers and sales leaders, if you wanna close more deals and drive real revenue growth, you need cash, and I don’t mean money. I’m talking about my new book, Cash, A four keys to better sales, smarter marketing, and a supercharged revenue machine. It gives you a proven framework to improve the four areas that impact revenue the most, communication, alignment, systems, and honesty. You need a stronger sales and marketing engine, and this book will show you how to build it. Get your copy now at aleejudge.com/cash. Now back to the content. Well, let’s talk about one of the biggest reasons pivots are happening right now. It’s pretty hard to talk about content without talking about AI that’s causing companies to pivot, people’s brands to pivot, what people talk about A pivot.

A. Lee Judge [00:08:30]:
And we know it’s changing A’ approach to content creation. So but how do you see AI transforming the way that marketers make data driven decisions and optimizing their content strategies using AI?

Joe Pulizzi [00:08:44]:
Can I be honest and say I don’t know? I mean, I think A if anybody knows the answer to that question, I would like to talk to them. I mean, I’ve heard you you’ve interviewed a lot of wonderfully smart people. They all seem to have some kind of an answer, but I haven’t felt like I’ve really heard the right one. Look at we don’t know. The tools that you and I are playing with right now, what are they? Nine, twelve, fifteen months behind? We don’t even know what’s going on behind the magic doors. I think what’s important is is that we spend about 10% of our time playing with these tools because we know that this is the direction it’s going. So let’s play with those tools and just make sure we do that. I like to see marketers use these tools, not for content.

Joe Pulizzi [00:09:27]:
I want if you’re looking for A, I I love when people are building their own personas out of an AI thread. I think that’s great. And then you can you basically put all the data and all the information into that, and you can talk to that persona anytime you want. What are you struggling with? What keeps you up at night? We’d love to do that with real people, but now we have AI that can help us do that. So we could use those tools to then get us to the point where we’re feeling like we’re doing something creative or maybe get faster to that point. That’s what I’m for. Do I have to come to the realization someday that the majority of the content that we engage with will probably be created by robots in the next few years? I think that’s actually going to happen. I don’t think that’s going to stop.

Joe Pulizzi [00:10:10]:
But at the same time, you’re going to have the opportunity because AI makes us more efficient to create some amazingly creative things. So the only the advice that I would give is, yes, it it’s gonna come. It’s gonna lean into that, but just dabble around. Get a cloth if you can do it, get a cloth subscription. If you can do it, get a chat g p t subscription. You know, play with A different imagery. Go in and play with some of those that really amazing long form reporting, that they’ve got going on with ChatGPT, and see what happens. And you will and when the time is right, you will know where it’ll make sense to to involve into your your data, your analytics, and your strategic frameworks.

A. Lee Judge [00:10:54]:
I think I don’t know. It’s probably the only intelligent answer anybody can give right now.

Joe Pulizzi [00:11:00]:
Actually, I I’ve been twenty five years, I’ve been at this business, Lee, and I think I don’t know is almost always my answer to things. Nope. It’s chain it is there are some things that are constant, but things are changing at a faster rate today. I think we just have to be prepared to change and be flexible as much as possible.

A. Lee Judge [00:11:20]:
Yeah. I I watch a few people that I follow specifically around AI, and the fun part is is is watching them test and say, this is what I see. What do you see? Everybody’s it’s almost like this virtual dinner table and we’re all taste taste testing new foods. Like, I tried this, it tastes this way. What do you taste? I’m eating the same dish but tastes different for me. And it’s A conversation A, what do you Lee, what’s going on, we don’t none of us know, but here’s what I’m seeing. And even experts are debating back and forth on what they saw and what they think is happening. It’s it’s a fun time.

Joe Pulizzi [00:11:59]:
I think watching, like, Dharmesh Shaw from HubSpot and Paul Raitzer from Marketing AI Institute A just follow their LinkedIns because they’re doing what you’re talking about. They’re basically, oh, here’s what we saw. Here’s what’s going on. Dharmesh is amazing because he’s tinkering with it all day long, and he’s trying to build things. I mean, if you and you get a front row seat to this stuff. So it doesn’t take much. We don’t have to go and get an MBA in AI. We just need to follow some of these people that are digging into it and do some of the work ourselves.

A. Lee Judge [00:12:28]:
Yeah. And when you can, catch them in A, an event like CEX. That’s exciting. Shameless plug there. How do you like that?

Joe Pulizzi [00:12:35]:
I won’t the whole point, of course, I want people to go to CEX, but any events. Like, literally go to any events and walk the halls. I mean, you and I, we met at an event. I mean, it’s we just I think people don’t they say, oh, I don’t like the agenda or the speakers or A, and you gotta realize that that is not the number one reason you’re going. You’re gonna go because in the halls, you’re gonna meet somebody that’s gonna change your life forever. And you’re gonna help them and they’re gonna help you. And I’ve seen that over and over again. It’s been true with Lee.

Joe Pulizzi [00:13:04]:
And that’s what I keep imploring on people is Lee, look, just be there. I remember South by Southwest when I was there in 02/2008 and 02/2009. I didn’t go to any sessions. I just hung around, and I met some of the most incredible people that changed my career. I mean, that’s the type of thing I think that we need to focus on. And, yeah, by the way, great speakers and great networking and all that. But

A. Lee Judge [00:13:26]:
Yeah.

Joe Pulizzi [00:13:27]:
That’s not the number one reason.

A. Lee Judge [00:13:28]:
This is my first year going to events as not an employee of a company and not a speaker. Lee, when I was an employee, I went as either a member of the company or a speaker on the side going to an event to speak, and then it would transition to I was going just to speak. But now, like you said, I’m A go to a few this year. I’m not speaking. I’m just going to network, to listen, to learn, to see what’s next, and develop relationships. That’s what it’s gonna be about.

Joe Pulizzi [00:13:58]:
That’s gonna and by the way, that’s exciting. I mean, I I was working on events for ten years A then started to actually just go to some. And it is just so it’s so refreshing to be able to do that and just and just walk around. And and by the way, for introverts out there, it doesn’t take much. And by the way, a little you know, one little thing that I think is really important A you really wanna meet a speaker, don’t go up after. Go up before. Before they’re waiting on the side, they’re kinda you know, everybody’s getting a a the the AV ready, and nobody’s talking to that speaker. That’s not that’s the time you go up and introduce yourself and say, hey.

Joe Pulizzi [00:14:34]:
Just wanna say hi. Love your stuff. Whatever. That’s it. Just put it out there and and prepare the way for for future A, but don’t go up after when you got a line of 20 people and, you know, they’re rushing through other speaker, go up before.

A. Lee Judge [00:14:48]:
Gotcha. Gotcha. Well, Joe, I wanna mention for a moment and and thank you again. So the book that I just put out is called Cash, and I went through Tilt A. It’s got Joe Pulizzi’s fingerprints all over it from the publishing company too. I think one of the first quotes in the book is yours as well. So in the book, you shared some information about content A. And building on that, I’d love to explore some current challenges marketers face today.

A. Lee Judge [00:15:14]:
What do you think is one of the biggest or just one of the missed opportunities that brands are missing in positioning their content today?

Joe Pulizzi [00:15:23]:
I would probably say the number one challenge that brands are taking advantage of is leveraging their employees as influencers and content creators. And there’s a hesitancy A you’ve seen this too, Lee, where you’re like, I don’t want to give the employee too much power. I don’t wanna give them too because, you know, you know things that happen. I mean, there’s scandals. There’s, you know, there’s information about employees that come out, whatever. And then I’m like, you know what? You have to think of your organization like you are A professional basketball team or baseball team or something like that, where you are gonna leverage. Your marketing is gonna be behind your stars. Well, your stars are your employees.

Joe Pulizzi [00:16:05]:
They’re your product managers. They’re your engineers. They’re your communications people, and you just have them work and sit behind the scenes, which is fine. A lot of people wanna do that, and that’s no problem. But you have a good percentage of people in your organization that are creating podcasts. They’ve got their own newsletters. They understand YouTube. Let them out.

Joe Pulizzi [00:16:25]:
Your employees are your best marketers, and you’re hiding them. Now what’s interesting is, like, even Unilever did this. I saw this announcement this week where they’re spending A. They’re they’re hiring or leveraging 20 times the amount of influencers in 2025 from 2024, which I’m looking at that, and I’m Lee, wonder. Their their their, percentage of social media spend, including influencers, is 30 to 50%. That is huge. That is a billion dollar A. But let’s look at their employees.

A. Lee Judge [00:16:59]:
Mhmm.

Joe Pulizzi [00:17:00]:
I mean, they’re out there leveraging people with audiences in different markets, different expertise, and that’s great. And you absolutely should do that. But look at the people that are right in front of A, the ones that are raising their hands saying, I’ve got something to say. I’ve got some expertise. I know something things that not a lot of other people do. Well, let’s put a podcast behind that person. Let’s put a YouTube video. They’re already there.

Joe Pulizzi [00:17:22]:
You have the expertise, and they’re already loyal to your company. So I think that’s the biggest missed opportunity I’m not seeing enough organizations do.

A. Lee Judge [00:17:30]:
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A. Lee Judge [00:18:23]:
Speaking of Unilever, is you think maybe there’s a difference between business to consumer and business to business? Because I’m thinking Unilever, they’re business to consumer every if I look at my shower, there’s probably six Unilever products from a shampoo to a soap that’s Unilever. Different brands, but if you look at the small print, you know it’s all Unilever. And I get that their employees are also using shampoo and soap, whatever, and they could be the influencers. But at the same time, this this model person with the beautiful hair may be the better influencer than the person who designed the shampoo. As opposed to business to business, the person who designed the software is probably the best person to influence me to buy it.

Joe Pulizzi [00:19:11]:
Wait. To your point, I a % agree. It’s much better on the business to business side. But because and and also for the fact that some of these deals in b two b are they’re just higher. I mean, some of them are tens of thousands, hundreds of A, some are million dollar deals, and you only need an audience of a couple. Like, if if you’re grooming somebody in your organization to communicate on a regular basis on LinkedIn, and they’ve got 20 or 30 of the right people looking at their regular posts on LinkedIn, that could be all you need. That could be amazing. Mhmm.

Joe Pulizzi [00:19:44]:
So give them and and what you don’t see enough of is just that internal training. I mean, what I would love to see like, if you find A, let’s say that person who wrote that software or designed that shower head or whatever, get them public speaking training. Help them with their writing. Put a team behind them. Get an agent Lee an internal agent, which is basically like a content marketing director, and help work with them on these things. And I think the other thing that’s really important that we’ve seen this trend is, if you’re gonna open an email today, you’re much more likely to open it from an individual than from a company or even from a company’s content brand. If we know that, maybe the thing you’re trying to do from a content creation standpoint doesn’t come from the company. It comes from that internal expert that you’re grooming.

Joe Pulizzi [00:20:31]:
And put a little faith in that person that they’re not gonna leave and not gonna do something A. And and it might happen. You might get, there might be one or 2% that don’t work out, but the 98% that do, wow. What an opportunity you’ll have. And I I think that that’s gonna be a trend in the next couple years. A lot especially on the b two b side. A lot of people leaning into internal employee experts.

A. Lee Judge [00:20:53]:
Well, I hope so because my business depends on it.

Joe Pulizzi [00:20:55]:
Well, they’re gonna need people like you to do to do this. And that’s where oh my god. Like, if you go in to just do a regular corporate content audit, you see it every time. You’re like, look at all this expertise out A, and you’re just silent.

A. Lee Judge [00:21:10]:
You know A funny? Silence. A I know you’ve seen this a lot too because we’ve worked with we had a client recently. They asked us for the whole kitchen sink of everything from strategy to content creation. But then they said, we wanna see our ROI in three months. And we’re like, okay, it doesn’t work that way. You know, first of all, they were posting their social media strategy was really jacked up and we were gonna help them with that. And we said, you know what? You need more of this kind of content, less of that kind of strategy. What we can do in three months is give you a very solid strategy and some examples of content that will fuel that A.

A. Lee Judge [00:21:50]:
Because we knew we were not gonna engage with any company with that kind of constraint, promising something we we don’t even believe in. The content is gonna create advertising A, like coin operated, do a post, get a dollar out. So we learned over time, of course, the ROI is such a it’s almost like a cloud over the creative process that Lee the bigger corporations, they diminish the creative because they can’t get the ROI fast enough. So when ROI is, you know, it’s always been a challenge for content marketing, especially when executives demand clear A. How should marketers manage, communicating their content initiatives to these executives?

Joe Pulizzi [00:22:35]:
You have to be real. First of all, when you measure anything in content marketing, it has to align with how the organization measures all of marketing. If you try to create something new, like this is how we measure it with our content, good luck with that. It’s not gonna work. So figure out and and you’ll you can. Sometimes it’s difficult. But what we really wanna do is communicate back to the executives and saying, okay. What are we doing on is it sales content? Is it savings content? Or is it sunshine content? Sales, savings, or A? Which means with this content, do you expect me to get sales? Mhmm.

Joe Pulizzi [00:23:11]:
Is this lead gen type content? That’s a very different type of content than savings. Are we doing this type of content to replace something that we’re already doing to save money? Is that a thing? Okay. Sunshine is my favorite one. Are we creating this kind of content to create better relationships with our current customers or just create better customers? That’s my that’s by that’s where content marketing started. It’s all on loyalty driven content. If you’d I know so many marketing directors that go out there and Judge, we need to be on social. We need to do the things. We want impressions.

Joe Pulizzi [00:23:48]:
We wanna be talked about in PR, and we want media mention, whatever. Okay. Fine. That’s those are all vanity metrics. Though that’s not gonna get you a promotion. That’s not gonna save your job. We have to figure out really clearly A then tell your Lee, this is why we are doing this. It because they don’t know.

Joe Pulizzi [00:24:10]:
They don’t know why you’re creating you’re creating more content than anything else you do in an organization right now. There’s so much content going everywhere Lee, but most leaders have no idea why you’re doing it. It, so you have to educate them. I would say A you define that, create some kind of internal communications piece that goes to the key decision makers, especially the one with the financial purse strings, and explain to them why you’re doing it. It makes you more accountable. Yes. And it is a little bit scary, but it works if you go, this is why we’re doing it. When I started in custom media and business publishing, they didn’t had the advertising and event people at Pet Media when I started their b two b media company had no idea what content marketing was and why A why we do custom media.

Joe Pulizzi [00:24:57]:
So every couple weeks, I would send out a care package through interoffice memorandum, believe it or not, with samples and then on a note that says this is how we did this. This is why we sold it. These were the effects of this. This is how A much money it brought in. Here’s how much profit to let them know that this was A thing and this is why we were doing it. So it’ll make your life a lot easier. So figure out why you’re doing it, be on the same page with your executives, and then create some kind of internal communications effort so that you stay top of mind to them as you go forward.

A. Lee Judge [00:25:29]:
It’s it’s an ongoing challenge for for content marketers, and there’s plenty of information and resources like us to help marketers guide their way. But it’s Absolutely. Lee battle. So, Joe, I wanna end on something that, we kinda chatted about Lee before we started recording. For me, each day after I’m on the TV or scroll through my phone, I see some kind of, headline or eye catching article and I think to myself, okay, somebody woke up today with a job to create content and this is a route they decided to take to get some eyeballs. And, you know, yes, there are people who are marketing for the businesses and for for publications, but then they’re also we all see content that we know someone had to make content A, and that’s what it feels like when you read it. So with content’s growing influence on public discourse, politics, and purchasing decisions, I think ethical considerations are becoming more and more important than ever. So in your view, what ethical responsibilities do content marketers have that maybe weren’t as critical in the past?

Joe Pulizzi [00:26:32]:
I think that if you’re a content marketer and you create a mission for your content brand, it has to be fully aligned with the mission of the organization. And I think sometimes we forget that because we get lost A this is we need this A. We need this analytics. We want this audience, whatever. And I think that what I would do to solve a lot of that is make sure your entire content creation team, internal and external, contractors that you have, align with understand the mission of the organization A then understand the underlying content mission of what you’re doing. So if you have a podcast that’s targeting a certain audience, that podcast has some kind of a mission. You know, we are talk we this podcast is specifically for talking about, political issues concerning the those in poverty A inner city, and we do this on a weekly basis. And our goal is to reach people of this stature in this marketing, whatever it is, whatever that mission is.

Joe Pulizzi [00:27:35]:
Make sure that everyone in on your content team knows that A, and this is what we align to. And they’re gonna be the watchdogs over all of this. I’ve been in too many organizations that they’re doing a newsletter, a podcast, a YouTube series, an event, and they don’t know the goal or the mission because nobody really spec spec A went out and told them. So tell them. Make sure it’s if it’s not written down, if it’s not typed up and printed out, make sure it’s a Google Doc or whatever, that they have access to it and point them to it on a regular basis. And even in some meetings, maybe every month, you start off with saying, remember, our mission is It’s more important than ever to be aligned with your ideals and what you’re trying to do as a brand. And if you don’t, sometimes you get caught in sticky situations. And most of those sticky situations are avoidable.

Joe Pulizzi [00:28:26]:
We just don’t communicate to the team. So what’s your mission? Communicate it regularly to the team, and I think you’ll be protected from some crazy situations, hopefully.

A. Lee Judge [00:28:36]:
That’s awesome, Joe. Let’s wrap it up. That was fun. I always appreciate A conversation with you. I wanna tell our audience, you know, that Joe is a great person to follow and learn from. I hope you’ll grab one of his books and catch him speaking up at an upcoming event or attend one of his events. So, Joe, tell us how can we catch you and what’s the next event we should attend?

Joe Pulizzi [00:28:55]:
So, yeah, the the two things, joepolizzi.com, p u l I z z I Com. I have a newsletter called Orange Letter. I’ve been sending it out for years and years and years. I talk about this stuff that we talked about all the time. And then in person, my next event is, as you mentioned, CEX, Content Entrepreneur Expo, August at the A Convention Center in Cleveland. And, in addition to you and wonderful other amazing people, we’re gonna be talking about how content creators can build financially sustainable businesses. And most of our audience are not the big creators. These are podcasters, newsletters creators, YouTubers that have hit on something special A haven’t quite made it yet.

Joe Pulizzi [00:29:38]:
And so we’re all there to help those people take it to the next level and become financially sustainable with the best business model in the A, and that’s being a content creator.

A. Lee Judge [00:29:47]:
That’s awesome. That’s that’s a mic drop. So once again, thank you, A. And thanks to the listeners. If you’re listening to the podcast and also want to see Joe and I video the podcast and others are available on the podcast section of contentmonster.com. Catch you next time.

Announcer [00:30:07]:
Thank you for listening to the business of marketing podcast, a show brought to you by contentmonster.com, the producer of b two b digital marketing content. Show notes can be found on contentmonster.com as well as a Lee Judge Com.